This interview was posted on FORT after a rather extensive and very insightful conversation about storyboarding. This show is all rather fake, friends.
http://www.freedrive.com/file/700512,bachelorbrad.mp3
My mind has been blown.
P.S. Off for a date with my niece. I'll get back to you later tonight :)
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Leen - I haven't read this article yet, but if I wanted to send you or Marianna an email, how would I go about finding your emails? I keep seeing it mentioned on the Bach board but don't see any feature where email addresses or contacts between users could be made. Would you please advise me?
ReplyDeleteI'll read the article shortly. I'm watching the Olympics right now and just wanted to drop you a quick note.
Hey Sheri,
ReplyDeleteGive it a listen. Everyone should listen to that interview. All the illusions come crashing down ;)
As for email, I don't think ABC allows for emailing, but you can reach me easily. Take my ABC screename and place @gmail.com after it. That's an email created expressly for Bach stuff ;)
I. heart. the Olympics :)
Per sdl at FORT on scripting/storyboarding:
ReplyDeleteI've talked to a lot of people about this, and the ones who are in the best position to know say that it is heavily scripted from the start. I think we have to put that in context because I personally believe that there are adjustments along the way.
- We know that they "cast" people to play particular roles - the virgin, the vixen, the vain one, the insecure divorcee, the fatal attraction, etc. But notice that every important character has a well defined flaw that is shown to the point that you can't miss it. Reid, who is much loved here, was OCD - they didn't have to throw that in. Ali was jealous and controlling, and then brought to her knees. This technique was a key element of all of Shakespeare's plays - every hero had a fatal flaw.
- We know that they review with TB the photos and resumes and develop a tentative F4 or F6 before shooting begins. Jason has said that he "picked" Melissa and Molly while sitting at a coffee table looking at all of these resumes. What he actually said was that he was blown away by Melissa - before he ever met her - and thought Molly was very attractive.
- We know that they start out with a basic outline of what they want the plot to be. This is undisputed. They have it story boarded in advance.
- We know that they write out cue cards for TB and the girls to read on camera, to get the footage they need, starting with the first episode. Some comments are shot out of order, like during dead time even before TB arrives.
- We know that they have all of the film footage before they ever show the first episode. This is where they create the final product. But it's great to know the ending so you can edit the first episode to set it up and create the most anticipation.
My guess is that Jake's edit could have gone one of many ways - they knew he would play the choir boy - but they had footage to make him the choir boy with a bad side. They didn't use it. Instead they made the F1 a bad girl, to pair the saint and the sinner.
Impressive work.
On Ed, I will always believe that his leaving was necessary because of the communications he had with other girls while on the show, and he was supposed to take care of personal business and come back, but instead he went home and slept with them because he lacks self control, and came back as planned. But I don't think the producers wanted him to give the show a black eye - at that point, coming back was drama enough. What was revealed later made a mockery out of the process, even if he and Jill someday get married.
Per jlccaz at FORT:
ReplyDeletePlanning storyline is not the same as picking F1 before the season starts to film!
They pre cast the F6 or F4, but even that could change. Theoretically, any of the 25 have a shot. It's just that in reality they don't have an equal shot, because the producers have an enormous influence over who gets camera time, what they talk about etc. If you don't get camera time, you don't get the Lead's attention, and no relationship can unfold.
Per Bloomers at FORT:
ReplyDeleteThey push these folks the way they want they to go by giving them certain dates and saying, " Talk about this or that." We know beyond a doubt that they sometimes "study their lines, " which would account for the fact that we often hear F2s say things like, " I feel like we are a couple," or "He is my boyfriend," or "She is my girlfriend."
Sometimes, the characters change positions like I think happened with Vienna this season, and is why Chris Harrison was able to say they are so fluid. I think she was supposed to be at the most F6 Drama Person, but Jake took an F4 (grouping) liking to her instead.
There is fluidity and I think the basic story can change as it goes, but there is no way that this process starts without a story in mind.
In fact, I think I remember Fleiss himself mentioning the storyrunner was already busy with the idea for the story for the next season in an interview.
Per veg_out at FORT:
ReplyDeleteEarlier in the season, I think, epi 4, Jessie made a comment on the bus that really stood out to me. When talking about eliminations, Ali said, "Vienna needs to go home." And Jessie said something like, "She could not even be going home. [They] could just throw us all for a loop." It's not very clear, the "they" part, but it doesn't sound like "Jake" or "he." If it is "they," then TPTB are making choices up to the F6 which nicely aligns with the pre-ordained F6 cast.
Per jlccaz at FORT:
ReplyDeleteFrom a psychological standpoint, the 6 weeks of filming have always been controlled and manipulated to maximize the chance that intense emotions will be present during the FRC. After 4 weeks, any couple where there is initial attraction, friendship, bonding is panting to be alone in the fantasy suite away from cameras (regardless of how "physical" that time is --it's a huge rush just to be together, away from filming activities), then the families are brought into it, and all the manipulation of "are you in love?!" "yes, I'm in love!" "do you have butterflies?!" "yes, I do!" "if you don't go through with a TV proposal, America will be so crushed, and the girl will be humiliated, you wouldn't want that, would you?" etc etc
I sort of see it as a spectrum, with Trista/Ryan on the end of "love happening" and Shayne/Matt on the other end, of a false process. Shayne was cast in the show as a star vehicle to launch her as a Tv Personality (not very successfully done, incidentally!). However, had Matt fallen for another girl (he now says he did not even come close), the producers would have taken that "romantic" ending, and slotted Shayne in to play the part of the Heartbroken Hollywood Actress. So, again, they do not start filming knowing "how it ends."
It's like cooking. Even if there's a printed recipe, and preplanned ingredients, no one knows what "dish" will be served at supper time when they plop the bag of groceries on the counter.
Yes, they have a plan -- whether it meets definition of story board or not -- but they depart from the plan at every step of the way in reaction to real world spontaneous events.
Per Bloomers:
ReplyDeleteTime and time again we have read where the contenders have said the feelings were real; on the other hand, I have read several descriptions of "in the moment" feelings as well where after they go home and get back into their normal routines, they rather quickly fall back out of it. Now, with that said, I think we have to take individual temperaments into consideration as well. It was clearly evident to me from both the show and excerpts from her MySpace that Moana is a supercharged sensitive melancholy temperament. I think it took her a while to get over her experience as the F2.
From Matt's radaronline interview it appears that they pushed him towards Shayne. He was "in the moment", and it appeared like the right thing to him at the time. Once they were out, he said it became evident that they were on different pages.
Jake said in an interview that he had been told that it would be obvious to him who his F4 would be, but he didn't know until halfway through the process. Who told him it would be obvious?
Yes, they push certain people even if he didn't favor them. Somebody has to get those dates, and we have to remember that those F4 dates don't happen in the time span we see them. They happen much quicker and have to be planned out much faster. So, who gets them and how is that decided?
If he didn't know ( let's give him the benefit of the doubt), then they planned out for him, and what he did was swap people around in positions. There wasn't time for him to get to know people, pick out people, producers plan for that date, etc.
Way, way back Chris Harrison said that Aaron B2 knew from the very beginning that Helene was going to be F1, so sometimes it is decided from the first night.
I think Melissa was another F1 from the start although it too ended badly.
Bob's F1 Estella looked a lot like the picture we saw of his ex wife. That was eerie! I wondered if psychologically he took a look at Estella and knew immediately she was his F1.
Likewise, although they brought Mary back 2 episodes late, she looked similar to Byron's ex wife as well. Many of us thought that just as soon as he saw Mary, it was over for the rest of them.
Now, I can't prove this, but somewhere along the way I definitely picked up this idea from something that was said. Sometimes, I think the Bachelor is allowed to pick his F1, and in some cases the producers may pick the F2 for the drama. It seems to me that one of the Bachelors was quoted as saying later that if he were to do it over, he would take ....and he mentioned taking someone else to the F2 and F3 which made me think the producers had dallied in the choices there.
I thought it my civic duty to enlighten each and every one of us. Should any muser need further confirmation, please send him/her to the RP ;)
ReplyDeleteWho knew you could have profile picture!?! How fun!!
ReplyDeleteInteresting interview Leen. Confirms what we already knew I guess.
This is fantastic, Leen! A real eye-opener! I think I'd like to have our group of regular musers take a look at this. Shall I tell them to come here? Nobody minds? I'll wait until I have permission...
ReplyDeleteM.
Hi Sheri,
ReplyDeleteYou can email me at mariannafrombachboard@gmail.com
I think I may already have your email, as you mailed me a request for my verboten musings last season where Ed had his supposed E.D. problem.
M.
I think anyone who is going to watch that 20/20 special which supposedly goes "inside" the Bachelor franchise must realize that it's really going to be just as edited as any episode of the show.
ReplyDeleteSure, they may show some bloopers and go behind the scenes a little bit but you can guarantee they're not going to reveal stuff that most of us really want to know about.
They're not really going to go into topics which make the show look bad.
Topics such as the storyboarding (the 'vixen', the 'victim', the 'vilain', etc).
Topics such as the room they have in the garage of the mansion where there is a photo of each contestant, to which is attached a growing file of information on that person, so that a "story" can be created about that contestant.
Topics such as how the producers carefully watch each date to see what each contestant's vulnerabilities are, so that they may be exploited later.
Topics such as the psychologists on staff who adminster ridiculously long questionnaires to each potential contestant, so that the show can pick only the kinds of personalities who fit into the master plan of manipulation that the show has.
Topics such as the often 4-hour-long limo rides when rejected contestants are kept virtually prisoner as the limo drives around while all kinds of inflammatory questions are hurled at them until they break down or say something camera-worthy.
Topics such as the the excessive splicing and editing that takes place when something a contestant says on week two is carefully fitted in to week five, in a totally different context, to make that contestant appear to have said something entirely different.
And yes, we won't even go into the double standards of what goes on behind the scenes:
Eye-witness reports of staff/contestant romances which go on undeterred. Special privileges which some contestants negotiate (keeping in touch with the outside world, for example) which are denied to other contestants. Reports of how certain contestants are guaranteed a spot in the F4.
And I'd love for them to address just exactly why they have such a menacingly iron-clad contract which forbids anyone associated with the show to reveal inside information. I mean, if everything was done honestly and above board, as one would assume it should be in a real reality show, why on earth have all this secrecy?? It's a tv show, for goodness sake, not the CIA.
Going "inside" the Bachelor show? I thnk not.
M.